Tamasoma Jyotirgamaya – May HE lead us from ignorance to knowledge
with 33 comments
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Written by Hariprasad
August 21, 2008 at 8:54 pm
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Sree Krishnaaya Namaha
Dear Shri. Hariprasad,
I was so thrilled and pleased to read your excellent write up of our Lord Bhimasena. I have endured the foul falsehoods spread about our Acharya Lord Bhima for such a long time that I had lost all hope of ever finding like minded souls such as yourself, willing to spread the truth about him. By the Grace of Lord Krishna, I hope once again to visit Sree Krishna Matha in Udupi and Madhvacharya’s birthplace in Pajakashetra this January 2009. When I visited the home of our Acharya Madhva last year in Pajaka, I completely lost control and started crying because I could not believe that God had blessed me with the opportunity of visiting the birthplace of none other than the third avatar of Lord Mukhyaprana. One has to pass many births to get the grace of even having the wish to attain Acharya Madhva as one’s Guru.
You are doing great service to Lord Krishna and Acharya Madhva by extolling the virtues of our Lord Bhima. I pray that one day, everybody realises that the greatest Pandava was not Arjuna but Lord Bhima because he never questioned or disobeyed his master Lord Krishna even once. He always upheld Bhagavata Dharma of Lord Krishna and for that reason Lord Bhima’s name must forever be praised and held in the deepest reverence.
I wish you much success, happiness and eternal service to Lord Krishna and Acharya Madhva.
Jai Shree Ram !! Jai Hanuman !!
December 16, 2008 at 1:04 pm
Namaskara Sri Karthik,
Many thanks for your kindest words. Yes, Lord Bhimasena is incomparably greater than the other Pandavas. Hopefully, in the coming years, we can bring out the real picture of this great Pandava and remove the misconceptions that exist in public minds today about Bhima being a glutton, fat person and so on.
Pajaka Kshetra is undergoing renovation currently. It may have been completed already. I am sure you will find a very ‘different’ Pajaka this time 🙂
Wish you all the best!
December 16, 2008 at 1:22 pm
Namaskara shri hari,
excellent write up
December 20, 2008 at 3:16 am
Namaskara Shri Hari: Great artcile on Shri Bhima. Thank you very much for your efforts.
Namaskara Shri Karthik Das: Your comments and esepcially your personal experience on Pajaka Kshethra moved me. I have resolved to myself that I must go and visit this most ausipicious place.
I was recently reading a book in English titled “Gita Sarroddhara” which is a collection of speeches by Shri Vishvesha teertha swamiji of the Pejawara matha, Udupi. In one of the speeches, Shri swamiji says that at the end of Kurukshethra battle, Dharmaraja asks his close associates about which Purusharatha among Dharma, Kama, Artha and Moksha is the most superior. People obviously praise the importance of Dharma, Artha and Mokhsa. Shri Bhimasena does not react and when Dharmaraja asks him, he astounds all by saying Kama is the most important. When Yudhishtira expresses his surprise and asks for an analysis, Shri Bhimasena tells him that without desire no Purushartha can be realized. One must have the desire to do Dharma or the desire to earn money rightfully (and use it for dharmic purposes) or the yearning to obtain Moksha by performing various good deeds. In other words, the most basic requirement is to have the Kaama to achieve something. Shri Bhimasena also tells the gathering, that the word Kaama is not to be interpreted in a negative manner – which usually happens – people think that kama means a selfish desire but Shri Bhima says that kama is our intrinsic desire (inner motivation) to obtain something (or to reach a goal) in a rightful manner.
This is a beautiful episode and I hope readers like it. If some one has similar examples of Shri Bhima’s greatness, I humbly request you to share it.
December 22, 2008 at 11:13 pm
Namaskar Shri Hari,
Bheema mentions kama because Lord krishna declares in Geeta that he is desire in the soul .while explaining his vibhuti rupas.
One mention of Lord Bheema’s quality deserves mention is he known as Vrukodara, because he has a agni called Vruk in his stomach. Thus he ate a lot without [bahubhuk] any problem.
We all know that man gets hungry because of jatharagni in the intestines.This jathargni for men is about 1millionth of the edge of nail of the thumb.[size] . Even such tiny agni when it lits up , we become restless for food and cannot overcome it untill we have some thing or the other pushed into our mouth. this jatharagni when deeptha can make us feel eat everything on the platter , it causes water in our mouth , but when it is dabbed , we feel satisfied.
But Bheema had the vruk of the size of thumb itself. one can imagine what digestive power it could offer him . Even if whole universe is usurped by BHeema [which he does at Pralaya] , his hunger could not be satisfied.
Thus he is Vrukodara , who has the capability of holding such huge jatharagni in his belly and yet can remain in controll of hunger and other desires.
December 24, 2008 at 1:57 am
Namaskara Sri Chiraan, Sri Raghu,
Many thanks for your valuable inputs on this topic. The page is getting even better with your insights.
December 24, 2008 at 10:17 am
Just to prove bhima is best Plz do not compare him with others like karna or ashwathama.Please go through entire mahabharata and then comment on other warriors.Karna uses only 1/10th of his power in battle ,owing to word given to kunti.This is stated by krishna at the end of war. Karna also spares arjuna s life twice during battle field.He defeats 4 pandava warriors on 15th day but sare their lives.(he defeats bhima ) Krishna himself states that no one can defeat karna unless one follows unjust means.
Ashwathama is also not an ordinary warrior. He had the power to burn arjuna alive through his arrows but krishna uses his power and because of hanuman on the flag , arjuna is saved. Ashwathama is the next veda vyas. So the next generation madhvas , including all our acharyas will be praying ashwathama. Just to explain bhima s greatness do not berate or comment others. All are unique in their own way. We need not rate them as no.1 or no.2 .Also we are not eligible enough to rate them . Leave this work to god.We are not god. Because you are a madhva that does nt mean , madhvacharya is the best and others are dumb. I am also born in a madhva family and am a stauch follower of SHRI VADIRAJA SWAMY. Only fools follow the path of self praise. Plz read all philosophies like advaitha , charvaka etc and then come to conclusion that dvaitha is best.This is good , but what u r doing is just extolling the greatness of ur favorite. Vivekananda , ramakrishna paramahamsa , shankaracharya have also seen and experienced god.They all followed advaithic way, so are they inferior to our madhva gurus? NO WAY. Everyone has his own way of approching and interpreting god.All are correct in their own way. This is what vadiraja swamy has preached. This is just a suggestion from me and I am no one to advice or preach u guys. I just put forth my opinion. Kindly let me know if u have any refutations.
December 26, 2008 at 12:11 am
Om namah Shivai. I had to stop here because
Mr. Pranav is also an honourable friend of mine. I had gone to an advaita ashrama of Swami Vivekananda and inquired whether advaita is mentioned in The Gita and the acharya over there assured me that each Chapter of Bhagavad Gita ends with saying Essence of Upanishads. The Upanishads mainly deal withg Advaita philosophy. The Bhagavad Gita Chapters like II, VIII and XVIII, may be referred for Advaita philosophy. I would like to verify this
August 12, 2010 at 4:23 pm
Your points would certainly be very valid if I had berated other philosophies or other warriors. Not just in this article, I do not berate other philosophies in this blog at all.
Similarly, with this particular article, I do not see where I have berated Karna, Ashwathama or other warriors. In fact, I have not even mentioned about Ashwathama anywhere.
I like Lord Bhimasena and this article is about the great qualities of that warrior. My article only sums up a few good qualities of Bhima. It DOES NOT berate anyone else.
>>”Just to explain bhima s greatness do not berate or comment others”.
Kindly let me know which part of this article berates others.
>>”Also we are not eligible enough to rate them”
I agree with your point that we are not eligible enough to rate people. I have not done that. Sri Madhvacharya and other great Swamis themselves have already done this. I have not created any new “measures” here or anywhere else. I am not qualified enough for that.
>>”but what u r doing is just extolling the >>greatness of ur favorite”
Yes, that is true. But I don’t see what is wrong with that. I like Dvaita philosophy and write about the nice things in that philosophy. I like Bhima and write about him.
>>” Only fools follow the path of self praise”
Not sure what constitutes self-praise according to you. Going by the same logic, all patriots would become fools because they like the country in which they are born.
>>”Plz read all philosophies like advaitha , >>charvaka etc and then come to conclusion >>that dvaitha is best”
You seem to have assumed that I have not read anything else.
>>”Everyone has his own way of approching and >>interpreting god.All are correct in their own >>way”
Most definitely. And this blog is about one such approach, that’s all.
December 26, 2008 at 10:20 am
Namaskar shri hari,
what is meant by staunch follower of vadiraj swamy, Followers follow everybit of advise and rules set by their gurus. Vadiraj swamy was first guru who explicitly berated other philosophies.[yuktimallika,shaiva sarvaswa khandana,Pashandavadkhandana] there is no proof that others have seen God or even realized him . Karna was defeated 22 times by Bheemasena in the mahabharath war , and when attacked he hid under the charriot [this even when he had shakti with him] had he not used shakti ,even ghatotkach would have finished him. even before Mahabharath Karna was defeated by Bheema [ he left him to live only for Arjun’s sake] this karna himself tells to Duryodhana that he is alive somehow before Bheema by God’s grace.
Ashwatthama is superior to Arjuna ,hence if he has superceded him .
Next time our dear Madhva friend should refrain himself from calling himself staunch follower. Staunch followers put faith in guru’s word by both heart and brain[intelligence]. Our friend’s heart is elsewhere and only ears to Vadiraj guru.
karna was no hero
if you permit to give a link
this article and discussion here will clear illusions about karna.
December 26, 2008 at 4:32 pm
Namaskara Sri Chiraan,
When I write my articles, I try to not create an impression about my beliefs at the cost of others. Which is why I found the previous comment on me berating Karna and Ashwathama strange. Thanks for this detailed reply by you. I fully agree with the points you have mentioned. In fact, I kept thinking about these exchanges yesterday and revisited Mahabharata (not just Tatparya Nirnaya). In Karna Parva alone, I found multiple instances of Karna being badly defeated. After every such episode, Dhritarashtra makes it a point to ask Sanjaya something to the effect of …”what happened after Karna had to retreat from the battle…”. But still, to say that Karna was defeated by Bhima does not constitute beration or insult to Karna.
As rightly said by our Guru “….Bheemasena samo nasti senayor ubhayorapi. Panditye cha patuthve cha shooratvepi balepi cha….”
This article simply subscribes (and whole heartedly at that) to the above declaration.
December 27, 2008 at 6:31 am
Jai Sri Vishnu
Most of above statements of Mr. Chiraan about Karna are chiraans opinions which are debatable however
I will answer mr chiraans statement “ there is no proof that others have seen God or even realized him” Because this concerns Swami Vivekananda who represented the Hindu religion on international level and brought glory to Mother India. He has inspired many freedom fighters including Gandhiji. Pranav maybe misdirected lekin galat aadmi bhi kabhi kabhi sahee baat bol jaata hai. To start with Chiraans statement No proof that others have seen God is very unique because in this world there are many people who are asking does God exist in the first place ? I have only this to say that a person who is God realized is in complete communion with Him and the words uttered by him or her are never wrong. This is applicable to even great devotees of God (Vishnu ) as well. Most if not all of their utterances or analysis of a particular situation are always correct. Take the example of Lakshmana in the Ramayana. He was a great devotee of God – Vishnu. When Sitaji saw the golden deer and expressed a desire to get it Lakshmana immediately said that this is some asuras maya because no such a deer can exist – was Lakshamana wrong no of course he wasn’t. When mareecha faked Lord Rams voice and shouted for help. Sitaji panicked and told Lakshamana to go to help the Lord. Lakshmana coolly answered that this is a trick no one can defeat Sri Rama. Lakshamana was as usual correct. Infact except the Bharat milaap episode Lakshamana situation analysis is always correct. This quality we see in Bhima as well. When Jaydratha had tired to kidnap draupadi he said that Jayadratha be killed. Had Jayadratha been killed at that time Abhimanyu would have been saved. Even when Duryodhana was captured by gandharvas Bhima opposed Yudhishthiras idea of rescuing Duryodhana. Had Yudhishthira listened to Bhima perhaps the gandharvas would have killed Duryodhana and the great war and slaughter would have been prevented. No word of a God realised person is ever wrong. A god realised person treats everyone with equality or tallying with the persons character. He/She is not affected by the persons social status or designation. Once when Alexander the great King of greece approached a sadhu in India and told him I am alexander the great conquerer is there any thing I can do for you ? The sadhu replied yes you can move out of my way you are blocking the sunlight. Hence you can see that the sadhu was definitely God realised and could put Alexander in his place.
December 31, 2010 at 11:58 am
ShriHari and Shri Chiraan: One should actually thank Shri Pranav for his comments because he provoked both of you to enlighten an ignoramus like me to learn so much more about our dear Shri Bhima.Thank you for the research you have done and may the Supreme Almighty Shri Hari bless you both.
One small doubt. In Chapter 10 of Gita, the Supreme Lord compares Himself to other noble things (which are anyways His creations) and declares that among Pandavas, He is Arjuna. (I think it is shloka 37). Can you throw some light on why He did not mention Shri Bheema and chose Arjuna instead. Thank you.
December 27, 2008 at 7:36 pm
Both my ears and heart pay attention to my gurudev but i do not follow everything blindly like u .Vadiraja swamy says that one can take up any path which is convinient to him and not just accepting something because he has said it.A guru always teaches his students not what he wants to teach but what is convinient for his pupils. Vadiraja swamy has also done the same thing. He has never forced anyone to follow his views.Guru always teaches what is correct for his disciples ; just as Shankaracharya , though being an exponent of advaitha made his disciple totakacharya realise god in vedantic way and his disciple hastaamalaka in meemasa way. Vadiraja Gurudev has always taught to respect other gurus and sadgurus . Vadiraja swamy has said that one should believe in a point only after analysis and complete study.He had never set any rule for anyone. Love and respect is what he has taught everyone.This is what even raghavendra swamy said at the moment of his brindavana pravesha. People will laugh at u if u say vivekananda has not realised god.Even the incarnations of vishnu like Kapila and vamadeva followed advaitic way to realise god. Kapila muni was the one who founded samkhya philosophy. So if dvaita is correct then what about samkhya founded by kapila himself.
Veda vyas the so called guru of madhvacharya takes his son shuka to Shiva for getting initiated. He clearly declares that there is no guru equal to shiva. Agastya panchika has a conversation b/w vyas and agastya and declares that vyas was an ardent devotee of shiva.Recollect the vedic hymn ” shivaye vishnu roopaaya , shiva roopaaya vishnave ” Both shiva and vishnu are equal. But madhvaacharya has stated in his taratamya that vishnu is greatest.
Mr orthodox “shri hari ” chiraan madhva , first u shoud refrain calling urself a madhva . Just as someone cannot rule u to stop saying u r a madhva , U also do not have the right to ask me stop calling myself a devotee of vadiraja swamy.My being a devotee of vadiraja swamy is my identity and I truly follow my guru s word of doing study and analysis before accepting anything.
Donot you know that parashurama himself declared that karna is his equal.
Refer this link to know to know KARNA:
Mr Hari , I respect ur attempt to bring followers of Dvaita under one roof and letting them know many hidden and lost points of dvaita. Am Not at all bothered abt chiraan’s hurls at me . I greatly appreciate ur sense of being calm and strong and not getting provoked when someone refutes ur view. This is ur blog , so i stepback from this argument. If u like plz mail me at firstname.lastname@example.org to give me ur opinions and views . We can continue our argument via email . In this blog others are getting “provoked” 🙂 and are not keeping their cool like u do.
December 28, 2008 at 3:48 pm
Certainly I do not want my blog to become a battleground for arguments about the various philosophies. Also not for personal abuses and counter-arguments. You have given us your email address and any one interested in taking this discussion further – we will talk to you over personal email. I am sure Sri Chiraan did not mean any personal abuses to you.
Your comments on Dvaita philosophy are very “strong”, to say the least. You mention “Ved Vyas the so called guru of Madhvacharya”. I find it disturbing to take this comment on my blog. The discussion started with you mentioning that I was berating others on this blog, which I contested. The whole discussion is going astray now. Let us take it up over email, if necessary.
December 30, 2008 at 10:24 am
Namaskar Shri Hari,
Keeping in line with the soft line of approach [ which a gemini can rarely be] of Shri Hari , i shall restrict myself to just upholding Dvaita .
Firstly we must commend Shri Pranav from demoting himself from Staunch follower to just a devotee [who is still analysing his guru’s words]. My advice is kindly don’t shy away from [refutation ,you had invited yourself , see last line of your previous comment].
Now let me highlight your confusion ,with flaws in your argument.
1. Dvaita is about sarvottamatva of Vishnu .[both Madhvacharya and Vadiraja as his follower unanimously agree without doubt.]
2.All avataras of Vishnu are one and the same .
3. Souls are/cannot be equal to God.
your flawed views,
1.incarnation of Vishnu took path to realise God [which god]
2.Parashurama vedvyasa ,Vishnu are one and supreme Paramatma.
3.Paramatma cannot and has not ever told that he is equal to Karna a jeeva.
your ref wikipidia is not authentic source ,now you have become ardent devotee of wikepidea also.
4.Kapila are two ,one of Vishnu and other normal, what you are referring is the jeeva kapila,Vishnu’s sankhya is repeated in Bhagavadgeeta ,it is acceptable and no different than Madhva.
5.There are certain Vedic hymns which declare Vishnu supreme , and next all names are of Vishnu so ,shiva the name is Vishnu’s not the shiva the Jeeva. [ quote from Shaiva philosphy ‘s refutation by Vadiraja ]
even when Vadiraja swamy has said Shivais not equal to Vishnu ,Vishnu is greater , if you say it is not so , are you with your guru [ you are challenging your guru’s words strongly , and also guru’s guru’s [Madhvacharya]words you are disputing .
analysing doesn’t mean accepting one and all sundry.
Come up with some logical refutation . Discussing coyly in a email will serve no purpose .
Shri Hari do not moderate this comment ,
As MAunam sammat lakshanam , [silence to a act anti is also a sin]
Shri Raghu ,
I agree with you on thanking Shri Pranav ,he has brought out certain issues which need introspection.
Bheemasena has one distinct quality ,[ his opinion is never different from that of Lord].Lord never disagrees with Mukhyaprana.
So he is not among the suffering souls.
The sufferance Starts Shiva onwards , Arjuna is the highest among the jeeva[dukhparampara] which required sermon ,he had a amsa of Narayana [nara narayana].
which ever quality is found greatest in any group Krishna is present there.
December 30, 2008 at 8:07 pm
Jai Shri Krishna
I have had the pleasure of debating with Mr. Chiraan on many ocassions. I agree with his above post but not entirely.Let me quote him Shri Parashurama vedvyasa ,Vishnu are one and supreme Paramatma.
3.Paramatma cannot and has not ever told that he is equal to Karna a jeeva.” Mr. Chiraan is correct
Yes avtaars of Shri Vishnu have infinite powers beyond human imagination but the battle competency of an avtaar of Shri Vishnu can be equaled. Bheeshma pitamaha did it in his battle with Shri Parshuramji in the Amba episode. Hence if it is indeed a fact that Shri Parshuramji told Karna that he is His equal it only refers battle skills. Not all capabilities.
June 8, 2010 at 9:04 pm
Seeing the vedic hymn. shivaye vishnu roopaaya , shiva roopaaya vishnave ” Both shiva and vishnu are equal “ Have done some humble readings on Mahabharata. Many time I read phrases Bheeshma is equal to Shri Parshuramji in battle. ( a fact revealed in the battle caused by Amba ). I have never read Bheeshma is equal to Devavratha.because both are the same man. Similiarly I read statements like phrases uttered by Bheeshma and even Krishna that Karna is equal to Arjuna in prowess. I never have read Karna is equal to Vasusena or Karna is equal to Radheya. I never read Arjuna is equal to Dhananjaya Because Arjuna and Dhanjaya are the same person just as Karna and radheya are the same person. If indeed there is a hymn in the Vedas that Vishnu is equal to Shiva then it has to be the Shiva who blessed Arjuna with Pashupata weapon and who gave Parshuramji is divine axe and who was honored by Lord Rama at Rameshwaram. Just as you cannot have a statement Arjuna is equal to Dhananjaya (another name for Arjuna ) Bheeshma is equal to Devavratha in battle prowess (again both the same person) you cannot have a statement Vishnu is Shiva( another name for Vishnu ).
November 26, 2010 at 4:47 pm
sorry for error what I meant was vedic hymn Vishnu is equal shiva cannot mean Vishnu is equal to Shiva (Shiva another name for Vishnu)
November 26, 2010 at 4:51 pm
Just like Sri Madhva, Sri Vadiraja Swamy also emphasized on analysis and understanding because “Tattvavada” gives maximum importance to “Anubhava” over everything else. This guidance applies to finding a way to realize GOD. But, this definitely does not mean that any way is acceptable.
Not just in his works, even in shlokas written by Sri Vadiraja Swamy, Vishnu Sarvottamatva and Vayu Jeevottamatva (and other Tattvavada tenets) are brought out very strongly.
Thanks for your inputs in the above comment. Your comments on my blog are indeed very valuable.
Rudra devaru certainly has a very high position in Dvaita philosophy. Rudra upasane is also very important to us. Worshipping devatas according to their taratamya is certainly something Madhvas follow. Even in the Vishnu Sahasranama, Vishnu is called as Rudra, Esha, Shankara, Shambhu, etc.
December 31, 2008 at 9:56 am
Namaskar shri Hari ,
Yes without doubt ,Rudradevaru has a highest position among the souls after parshuklatraya.
Without his blessings devotion[amlabhakti] is just not possible .Even Arjuna was sent to Indrakeel parvat by Vedavyasa for rudropasana with upadesha of roudri mantra.
even in peetha pooja rudra is prayed twice as vairagya , and absence of it. Shuka[incarnation of Shiva] is still held as the highest example of vairagya. He is the one who has given us all sweet phala of Bhagavat.
I agree with you that discission was going astray , as it started with a madhva analysing some other tatva , then madhva garb was thrown off and Advaiti appeared ,suddenly these inner wears were also shed and came Hariharamata [shiva vishnu aikya] ,i think next would be an appearance for JGK, follow none ,follow your heart .
It was neccessary to remind that this page is about Greatness of BHeema .
Mukhyaprana is father and Guru of Shiva .
It was mukhyaprana who had primarily drunk the halahal and gave a pint to Shiva and Shiva became neelkantha.
Thank you for bringing back the discussion.
December 31, 2008 at 3:59 pm
Namaskara Shri Hari ,
grab :- garb
kindly moderate the spelling mistakes
and Namaskara [address] , its a typo mistake.
December 31, 2008 at 4:06 pm
Hmmmm …. this article is now many months old….but, I still could not resist the temptation( to comment ). After all, the champion of champions, Draupadi( Bharatidevi )-ramana-Bheemasena is involved !!!
Most points, though, are directed at the misinformed Pranav.
1. A debate based on logic( tatva vaada ) is one of the best ways to learn the eternal truth. Hence before a mentioned point( like the one by Shri Hariprasad, which bespeaks of quality research )is disseminated for unwarranted and provocative debates, the logic( tatva ) of the debater should first be sown in the right soil of knowledge, and should only be used for a debate once it is fully sprouted. Alas ! Not only is Mr.Pranav’s arguments premature sprouts, but also seems sown in the soil of andhakaara.
2. Secondly, DVAITA philosophy emphasizes the importance of calling a spade, A SPADE. Which means, it doesnt matter if, in the process some feelings get hurt( in any case, only the agnanis would feel hurt, the ones who have the yogyatha would feel elated ), what remains most important, in this regard, is to HIGHLIGHT Bheemasena’s might.
( to be contd … )
April 29, 2009 at 10:56 pm
My salutations. Respected Sir in my humble opinon the Stanza of Sri Krishna in the Gita – I am Arjuna among the Pandavas is proof that its Arjun who is Supreme among the Pandavas. Even Lord Shivas boon to Jayadratha included Bhima excluded Arjuna -that one day he will check the formation of Pandavas.
Jayadratha was a last minute development infacat seeing the Chakravyooha Bhima was as tranfixed as the remaining Pandavs and Abhimanyu was sent in. Later on Pandavs were stopped by Jayadrath. In Dronas ashrama Bhim also gave the unimpressive answer like that he could see everything including the birds eye. Bhim was the greatest devotee but cannot be compared to Arjuna
September 7, 2009 at 4:47 pm
Jai Sri Krishna. Respected Sir Karna was an arch rival of Arjuna. He may or may not be equal to Arjuna but certainly created an impact that well wishers of Arjuna like Indra and Yudhishthira had a genuine concern for Arjuna. Yudhishthira was a man known to worry unnecessarily also ie he was worried about bakasur and jarasandha 2 people whom Bhima killed easily hence his worrying does not make Karna great. But we must realise that age changes us all. The sachin tendulkar who faced and demolished Shoib Akhtar in the world cup was a much more evolved batsman than the one who was injured by Waqar Younis in his debut match. Same is logic applicable to Yudhishthira. In the bakasur episode yudhishthira only had material knowledge but by the time kurukshetra war started he was much more spiritually evolved. He had completed the Rajasuya yagya and attained spiritual merit. He had witnessed the power of Krishna in Shishupala and draupadi protection incident. In the vanvaas had propriated Surya devta and got the akshay patra. He answered the questions posed by Nahusha the python and the Yaksha. Hence the Yudhishthira worrying about Karna was a much more wiser and accomplished person than the one who was worrying about bakasur. In the war Yudhishthira was never afraid of Jayadratha Bhagdatta Duryodhana Alambusha etc. Like Indra in fearing he also starts and stops with Karna Bhima was the bravest of the brave and definately has registered upperhands in duels with Karna. But there are also records of Karna doing the same. In all fairness a duel between Karna and Bhima cannot be taken seriously in competency evaluation becoz both these gentleman had no intention to kill each other. Karnas licence to kill was revoked by mother Kunti and Bhima from his point of view could not kill Karna as Arjuna vow would be nullieifed.
February 14, 2010 at 7:41 am
Bowing at the lotus feet of shree Madhavacharyaji below are some extracts which I found in
Mahabaratha Tatparya Nirnaya
– Introduction by Prof.K.T.Pandurangi
Karna is installed as Commander-in-chief
Karna’s Chariot stuck into the ground
Arjuna and Karna exchanged all important weapons like aneya, Varuna. Karna employed Sarpastra. Shri Krishna pushed the chariot five feet in the earth. The weapon hit the crown of Arjuna which was broken into pieces. Karna continued fighting. However, his chariot was pushed into the ground due to the curse of a Brahmana. He forgot the wielding of his weapon also due to Parashurama’s curse. Karna asked Arjuna to wait until his chariot was lifted up. Arjuna employed anjalikastra. Karna’s head was served, it flew up and fell.The head and the trunk of Karna’s body fell apart.
( Sorry I beg to differ. Mahabharata clearly mentions when karnas chariot wheel was stuck he requests Arjuna to stop battle. Shri Krishna chastises Karna then Karna fires a sizzling arrow which renders Arjuna unconscious. This Arjuna being rendered unconscious is very conveniently not mentioned here )
Below statement is ungulpable
) kIchakasya hiDimbasya bakakirmIrayorapi | jarAsandhasya nRuipateH kaMsAdInAM cha sarvashaH || 23.37|| na bAdhanAya bhIshhmAdyA api shekuH kathaJNchana | tasmAt.h te kIchakaM shAntaM shrutvA mAtsyaM yayuryudhe || 23.38|| 37-38. Bhishma and others were not capable of controlling Kichaka, Hidimba, Karmira, King Jarasanda, Kamsa and others. Therefore listening to the news that Kichaka was dead they waged war against Virata. Notes: 1. Though Bhishma was a great warrior, he could not defeat Virata who was under the patronship of Kichaka
( friends Bheeshma was a warrior whom even Parshuramji an incarnation of Shri vishnu could not defeat how can Keechak or any one be superior to him? This is clearly a bhima advertisement. Ie Keechaka inferior to Bhima superior to bheeshma hence Bhima superior to Bheeshma. I am ready to acknowledge such works as 80 authentic or even 90% but NOT 100 % authetnic
November 8, 2010 at 4:48 pm
Please obtain a full copy of the MBTN and go through. Half of your above doubts will automatically get cleared. The instructions and gists provided in the translations you have referred to are intended to create interest in one to go through the whole. Please don’t use them to arrive at conclusions.
November 9, 2010 at 9:26 am
Dear Shri Hari
In your discussion on kukke subramanya temple you referred to the moola mantra of subramanya (om namo…..kaamarupine……). Can you kindly send this version/variation of the mantra to my email id.
November 10, 2010 at 5:57 pm
Does the Madhawa philosophy sanction that all incarnations of Vayu are equal to each other. By this logic Hanumanji and Bhima are equal to each other but Mahabharata does mention an encounter that takes place between both of them Where Bhima is in search of some celestial flowers meets Hanumanji on the way who is in disguise.
Below is extracts of conversations from Mahabharata version – “The monkey answered: “O mighty hero, be patient. Be gentle as you are strong, and have mercy on the old and weak. I have no strength to rise up as I am decrepit with age. Since you have scruples in jumping over me, kindly move aside my tail and make a path for yourselfProud of his immense strength, Bhima thought to pull the monkey out of the way by its tail. But, to his amazement he could not move it in the least, though he exerted all his strength. He set his jaws and strained every muscle till the very sinews cracked and he was covered with perspiration, but, still, could not move that tail the least, a little bit up or down or side-ways. in shame, he bent down his head, and then asked in a chastened mood: “Who are you? Forgive me and reveal to me whether you are a Siddha, god or gandharva.” Bhima like most strong men, was all respect when he saw one stronger than himself, and spoke like a pupil addressing his master.Hanuman replied: “O mighty-armed Pandava, know that I am your brother, even that Hanuman, the son of the Wind god, whom you mentioned a little while ago.” This clearly proves Hanumanji was superior to Bhima according to Mahabharata.
November 18, 2010 at 12:10 pm
It cannot be argued that Bhima was a man of wisdom and a great hero and a good human being. But what makes a good human being a great human being is power of forgiveness which both Bhima and Draupadi lacked. Their philosophy was an eye for an eye a tooth for a tooth. In the end Draupadi suffered a fate worse than Dhritharashtra. The blind king atleast had one son surviving ie Yuyutsu who had joined the panadavas. He had a daughter surviving Dushala. Draupadi lost all her sons and we see Gandhijis statement an eye for an eye will make the whole world blind ringing completely true. Arjuna had power of forgiveness in him. Despite the ill treatment received from the Kauravas he had sympathy for them and thats why he had to be given Gita updesh. Krishna also said in the Gita Among Pandavas I am Arjuna. Stamping on the head of your opponent who is already dying is not my kind of heroism. Agreed what Duryodhan did was wrong but what Bhima did was also wrong and 2 wrongs dont make a right. Junglee janwaar ka shikaar karna hai to karo lekin uska shikaar karte samay agar tum khud bhi junglee ban gaye to kya fayda. Arjuna Rama Krishna
Lakshmana Balrama also killed their opponents who were evil men but they never showed this disrespect. Even Sahadeva while killing Shakuni- the root cause of the Pandava problems excercised decency and didnt indulge in any headstamping or dancing around dead body hooliganism.
November 20, 2010 at 1:08 pm
When we talk about the greatness of a particular charecter of mahabharata, supporters of other charecters of mahabharata take it as an insult to their favorit charecters.This is wrong. They can protest if anyone create their own stories to glorify a charecter. But if write on the basis of what is given in mahabharata scripture, then no one should feel bad about that. When we write about Bhima’s greatness as a warrior, we also write about his performence in kurukshetra war, where he defeated warriors like Drona, Karna and Ashwatthama. That does not mean that Drona, Karna and Ashwatthaman were ordinary warriors. They were also great warriors. These warriors also gave great performence on their day. Karna gave a very tough fight to Arjuna after Vrishsena’s death.
These are some points that proves Bhima’s greatness, which is true as per Mahabharata scripture:
1.Bhima killed Jarasandha in a fair battle and brought Karna under his sway before the rajsuya yagna.
2.No warrior could save Duryodhana’s brothers from Bhima.
3.Bhima sent Drona in to swoon by piercing his body with fifteen arrows. Drona was taken away from battle field.
4.Bhima successfully checked 10 kaurava warriors including Drona and Shalya on 10th day of battle.
5.Bhima defeated Shalya in an encounter with mace.
6.Once Ashwatthama was about to succumb to an attack by Bhima and Drona had to rescue his son.
7.Next encounter between Bhima and Ashwatthaman resulted in a tie, but Bhima performed better.
8.Bhima defeated Drona on 14th day of battle.
9.Bhima defeated Karna repeatedly on 14th day even though Karna got rienforcement from Duryodhana’s brothers.
10.Dhritrastra said to Sanjaya that day that no one can dare to face an angry Bhima. He also said that Ashwatthman, Kripa and Shalya fighting unitedly could not stay in front of Bhima.
11. Bhima defeated Karna again on 17th day.
Anyone can crosscheck these points with Mahabharata scripture.
September 18, 2012 at 10:16 am
Point 10.Dhritrastra said to Sanjaya that day that no one can dare to face an angry Bhima. He also said that Ashwatthman, Kripa and Shalya fighting unitedly could not stay in front of Bhima. — does a disilluisioned character in dhritharashtras opinion really matter?. He knew nothing of both dharma and shastravidya.
December 14, 2012 at 9:20 am
I have read all of your opinions and felt very happy…I like Mythology like Ramayana and Mahabarath…But Epic Mahabarath inspired more in my life. We can’t find this kind of Epic in whole world….It’s very precious and all characters are very important….all are very great warriors with great soul.
Starting from Lord Krishna….he has played central role and Mahabharata will start with him and end with him….He himself is the God and played all kind of roles and showed us to follow right path. I am saying from bottom of my heart like I will get inspired while hearing any character from Mahabartha. I feel i would have lived in that time as ordinary man to see the glorious epic. It’s amazing while thinking about each characters in Mahabarath.
If we keep on writing about Krishna and Pandava’s then no end…even other greates like Bheeshma,Karna,Drona,….etc
In brief i wanted to express my opinion towards among Pandavs. Once again each and every pandavas are importanat.But in terms of warrior concerns then definitely first Bhim and Arjun comes in our mind.
No doubt Arjun is the great warrior and also he is more close to Lord Krishna. In fact Arjun is high profile personality and more likes Krishna So that Lord Krishna has advised Bagvath Geetha to him.He is the great sould. Interesting thing is that Dharmaraya always followed “Dharma” path even Lord Krishna has not chosen dharmaraya to teach bagvath geetha…..it’s strange but true….So Arjun is the great archery and great soul and one of the main character in whole Epic.
But my personal opinion abou liking the character in epic…one and only Bhima….Please don’t misunderstood me….this is my personal opinion only… Bhima has showed he strong strength throughout the Epic ….Bhima himself has played central role in Kurukshetra war and he has killed many of Kaurava’s compared Arjun….Bhima has showed his great strength all the time(not only in kurukshetra war).Example:at foest exile also. I love him personally because of his great strength all the time….even he has showed his strength during their final journey to heaven….like in Kedarnath Bhima has tried to hold Lord shiva in Bull form and also he has put very strong stone to move their journey(Bhim patthar)…and also he has killed Bakasur during forest exile….and Keechaka…..I like Bhima because he will fight in empty handed and it shows his great strength and he is very skillfull to handly Elephant in empty hand.
More interesting thing apart from his strong strength and food , he is great administrator and always respect to Lord Krishna and elders. We has showed some anger with elders in exceptional case because of the situation. Instead of thinking about who is graet warrior whether Bhima or Arjun or Karna….better we will feel every characters in the Epic. They are all great souls…..I personally can’t stand in front of ordinary character in that period….It inspired a lot while thinking about all great souls of Mahabharath.
Please I am sorry if I could have hurt anybody’s feeling.
July 9, 2013 at 12:42 pm
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